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Author Topic: German Blue Ram sexing help please  (Read 2368 times)

Offline Cuninho

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German Blue Ram sexing help please
« on: November 21, 2018, 01:57:44 pm »
Hi all, newbie here.

Joined after floating in the background for a while and sucking up all of the information so thanks for that!

So I have had the 3 rams for a month or so now. The bottom 2 are paired up, lowest being the female, but im wondering whether I actually have this right.

The colour differences are so different with the pair and the big one up top, also the male sometimes has a pink stomach. Am I right in thinking the bottom 2 are really young as they are so small comapred to the 3rd and she has a lot darker colouring? They almost look half gold ram, half blue.

Please correct me if im wrong, and it would be awesome if there is anyone who can roughly age these via the colours?

Thanks a lot, also, any Ram info or tips are greatly welcomed!  *cheers*

(Added more pics. 2nd image is of the larger female and the 3rd image is the male. In my mind anyway :D)

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    Offline plankton

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #1 on: November 21, 2018, 04:24:12 pm »
    I'm hopeless with cichlids, but, if I were going to guess, I'd guess all males, with the one you think of as being male being a gold morph version.......as I said, I'm hopeless.
    Sent from my PC as I still don't understand the the logic for mobile internet usage ;) *grin*
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    "We found this spoon sir"

    Take it easy
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    Offline Stephen

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #2 on: November 21, 2018, 04:28:09 pm »
    Wow! they are beautiful fish.  *grin*

    Adult males grow larger than females, possess slightly more-extended fins, and are more intensely-coloured.
    Most females possess a pinkish patch on the belly which is absent in males, although this may not be the case in some ornamental/morph strains.
    Look after your fish and the water, do regular water changes & maintenance, do your research and the hobby will be rewarding.
    All the best
    Stephen

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #3 on: November 21, 2018, 04:38:40 pm »
    Thanks for the replies.

    Yeah I'm thinking the smaller 2 that are paired up are juvenile and maybe part gold like said? I know juves are more washed out but they're really gold minus the front end lol.

    The one I believe to be male does have the elongated fins, whereas the other 2 don't they have more rounded fins. Male doesn't have the pink stomach either like the others.

    I just have no idea haha the one big ram is double the size of the other 2, but the "male" is the dominant one in the tank.

    My tank is also full of tannins as I went for the old Amazon feel, this does not help with looking at colours though haha

    Offline blackghost

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #4 on: November 21, 2018, 06:14:27 pm »
    You have three females. Middle fish (top picture) is a long-finned variety, which explains the difference in finnage. They’re standard Rams (sold as German Blue Rams but they’re not). No Gold Ram in them either. They’re pale because of the unnaturally (to them) bright substrate.

    Top fish is in breeding condition. You can tell by the ‘egg tube’ just in front of the anal fin, and the pink belly. If one was male those two would be getting on with breeding and the other would be chased away.

    If you want a pair I would suggest just keeping one of the three and adding a male. If you keep the one in breeding condition you’ll need to add a male in breeding condition (very colourful), or if you keep one of the others you’ll need to add a male that isn’t yet in breeding condition (not so colourful).

    You’ll get much better colours out of them on a dark substrate. Light substrates keep the colours somewhat muted.

    They’re young adults.

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #5 on: November 21, 2018, 06:53:26 pm »
    Thanks a lot :) that does actually make sense, I read about the dark/light substrate stuff but totally forgot, maybe I'll change it at some point. They're doing great health wise though so I may leave as is.

    So with the 2 gold kinda ones, is it normal they are constantly together and the long fin chases the breeding ready one away? They're both from the same batch sold at maidenhead as Germans, could they have a bond from being raised together? It's so weird, but I suppose this is why people love em, such personalities.

    Surprisingly as well they seem to love my corys. My corys laid eggs which it almost seemed the 2 rams were guarding lol. Managed the get the suckers out though before they started eating them. Have a 10 gallon now full of cory fry haha.

    You can just see some of them below.

    Thanks again for the info!

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #6 on: November 21, 2018, 07:00:14 pm »
    Quick update, they're making a damn crater in the sand lol could this be to sleep in as opposed to laying eggs? They usually sleep in little separate ones, but they're putting a shift in here. Man I love these fish haha

    Offline B-ri86

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #7 on: November 21, 2018, 10:02:10 pm »
    You have three females. Middle fish (top picture) is a long-finned variety, which explains the difference in finnage. They’re standard Rams (sold as German Blue Rams but they’re not). No Gold Ram in them either. They’re pale because of the unnaturally (to them) bright substrate.

    Top fish is in breeding condition. You can tell by the ‘egg tube’ just in front of the anal fin, and the pink belly. If one was male those two would be getting on with breeding and the other would be chased away.

    If you want a pair I would suggest just keeping one of the three and adding a male. If you keep the one in breeding condition you’ll need to add a male in breeding condition (very colourful), or if you keep one of the others you’ll need to add a male that isn’t yet in breeding condition (not so colourful).

    You’ll get much better colours out of them on a dark substrate. Light substrates keep the colours somewhat muted.

    They’re young adults.

    What is a standard ram? Do they need the same parameters as a German blue like warmer temps?

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #8 on: November 21, 2018, 10:06:30 pm »
    Mine are in super soft water at 26c if it helps any. They're doing awesome as well so if they are standard rams (I didnt know about standard) I presume they like the same params.

    Offline blackghost

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #9 on: November 22, 2018, 07:20:34 am »
    By “standard Ram” I just mean this... Rams are a variable species. They have a large natural range and vary quite a bit throughout that range. They’ve been commercially bred for ages and so there’s a fair bit of variety in them. But they’re just regular Rams and not ‘German’, despite what the shops sell them as.

    The Germans produced a variety, by chance, that was different in that it had more black markings and the spot on the side was very large. Because this was a new variety it was very popular, so the Singapore farms decided to call all of their Rams ‘German’ so they would still sell. These days ‘German Rams’ are very rare, partly because they became very weak through inbreeding, but Singapore still list theirs as German so the shops that can’t be bothered to find out this information still sell them as German.

    The ‘Blue’ part to the name is also misleading and is because the American common name for the Ram is Blue Ram, although not all Rams have blue on them.

    So your fish are ‘Rams’ (English name) or ‘Blue Rams’ (American name) although nearly all Rams these days are incorrectly sold as ‘German Blue Rams’.

    Parameters are exactly the same for all varieties.

    As for the pit digging... it’s the two short finned ones that are doing it? It’s not uncommon for female cichlids to spawn together if the urge is strong enough and there’s no male. Usually one will lay eggs and the other will go through the motions, so it looks like it’s a male fertilising the eggs. Rams lay their eggs on a flat surface (eg a rock) and if there aren’t any they might dig to try to find one. But it’s really just a way of getting rid of the eggs.

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #10 on: November 22, 2018, 08:20:45 am »
    Awesome information thank you.

    It's the 2 small ones so the long fin and the smallest one doing the digging.

    Ahh so that's where all the horror stories probably come from about german rams being so hard to look after, these overbred Asian farms?

    Hole got bigger overnight but they're not bothering with it now.

    Thanks again!

    Offline blackghost

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #11 on: November 22, 2018, 08:32:35 am »
    Farmed fish aren’t so hard to keep as long as you keep them warm, in pristine soft water. Wild caught Rams are much more difficult.

    You’re keeping yours very well. I kinda fell in love with them again when I saw your first picture.

    :)

    Offline Cuninho

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #12 on: November 22, 2018, 08:50:43 am »
    Ahh nice, thank you. Although I will admit my tap water seems like gold liquid to fish, comes from the lake district and is really soft, I did worry about the ph being around 6ish but they seem to be loving it.

    The tannins from the wood as well made a huge differnce to activity, they got a massive boost in energy. Whether it's because it's more natural to them and kinda blocks out some light I don't know. Now just to work out how to maybe cover patches of sand so it isn't as bright to them.

    Yeah they're lovely fish, just hope the little ones colour up a bit more as they camouflage in to the tannin coloured water haha.

    Offline blackghost

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    Re: German Blue Ram sexing help please
    « Reply #13 on: November 22, 2018, 02:07:12 pm »
    I have that water too, it’s great for soft water fish. :)